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Why oh why??? huhu :)

By Lunkan
10/28/2018 9:14 am
(Perhaps this belong to Bug - or here :) I know it's very hard to make a computer "think" as a human as when QB try to "see" if opponents cover recievers or not, but I believe the following things are rather easy to solve.)

(I don't talk about eventual exception desperation actions close to end of a match.)

1. It's common punts are just over the middle line, giving the opponent close to a field goal position DIRECT! huhu Why ever punt shorter than to the 20th...??
(I don't know how hard it is to kick an American football far, but I could kick a soccer ball still higher than a jumping defender 60 meters away, so I suppouse a profesional punter is suppoused to manage to kick to the 20th.)

2. Both defenders and attackers seem to have no clue where the 1st down (=yellow in graphic) line is. Recievers could easy have turned to get the missing yard/inch and THEN get stoped. Instead they run PARALLELL with the 1st down line and by that often miss to get the missing distance. That happen even at 3rd down. And why stay defenders and WAIT for attacker to reach the END zone instead of trying to stop him BEFORE reaching that??

3. I haven't counted but it seem SHORT (=runs or short passes) are called very much more often at LONG and MEDIUM 2nd and 3rd down, than I have put the Gameplan too (=All three settings are down at the bottom.) Or doesn't the system count 3rd and 12
or 2nd and 25 as long? :)

Re: Why oh why??? huhu :)

By Lunkan
10/29/2018 4:05 am
I forgot one:
4. Why is AI playing 3rd or even 4th choises allready early in the game in positions needing one (or two)???
The better ones can't be tired that fast and they weren't injuried.
I had put them on the Depth Chart list at the position just to be used IF the better ones get injuried or to tired.

Re: Why oh why??? huhu :)

By wieczoreks
11/02/2018 11:15 pm
1) not sure i understand what you're asking
2) haven't observed this in my games
3) Make sure your GP Distance Adjustment Speed is set to 0. There's a whole tread around her somewhere that explains how anything other than 0 changes what short/medium/long mean during the game.
4) It really depends on the position. Some defensive formations call for extra CBs for instance.

Re: Why oh why??? huhu :)

By raymattison21
11/03/2018 7:08 am
1. Is how punting works. If you rocket the ball down there the return team has a better chance to set up a good return. You want to kick it high in order to allow your players to get down field and cover the punt. At best most guys will average 50 yards a kick because of hang time of the ball.

2. Is a known bug. Or that is the game logic. Intelligent receivers run routes to the first downs, and I like to think smart RBs find the hole better , but in terms of running with the ball or tracking ball carriers speed kills. Perhaps something moderates tackling angles, but my advances on that subject have led to little info.

In the testing league , looking at the run game was on the docket, but passing algorithms and man to coverage is the focus a the moment.

3. Under game planning in miscellaneous you will find the game play agjustment, slow down, and hurry up. They all effect offensive play call outcomes. I run 21 gpa, 7 hu, and 7 sd. A zero setting should call most of your plays .

4. Is player fatigue . The miscellaneous section allows you to adjust when you want a position group pulled due to fatigue . By setting the depth chart deep and using overrides is a great way to keep guys fresh.

Re: Why oh why??? huhu :)

By Lunkan
11/04/2018 6:45 am
wieczoreks wrote:
1) not sure i understand what you're asking.
I want my team to punt at least to the 20 yard line, but often they punt just over the middle line so the opponent get there by just a Fair catch.
wieczoreks wrote:
3) Make sure your GP Distance Adjustment Speed is set to 0. There's a whole tread around her somewhere that explains how anything other than 0 changes what short/medium/long mean during the game.
I have read that before. As I understand THAT topic, if the 1st down is short, then 2nd and 3rd down will become even SHORTER if puting that to 0.
It make NO SENCE anyway if THAT - or anything else - make the sim make a short play EVER, when the settings for short plays are ZERO...
wieczoreks wrote:
4) It really depends on the position. Some defensive formations call for extra CBs for instance.
I wrote "4. Why is AI playing 3rd or even 4th choises allready early in the game in positions needing one (or two)??? "
I reacted at matches playing 3rd and soon after 4th RB, still EARLY in the game, in plays needing 1-2 RBs. (I don't remember which matches.)

Re: Why oh why??? huhu :)

By Lunkan
11/04/2018 7:05 am
raymattison21 wrote:
1. Is how punting works. If you rocket the ball down there the return team has a better chance to set up a good return. You want to kick it high in order to allow your players to get down field and cover the punt. At best most guys will average 50 yards a kick because of hang time of the ball.
I suppouse running from 10th to 30th is counted as a "good return". But if punting only to 40-50th line, then the opponent DON'T NEED to run anything to get that far, BEING there DIRECT :) by just make a Fair catch...
raymattison21 wrote:
2. Is a known bug. Or that is the game logic. Intelligent receivers run routes to the first downs, and I like to think smart RBs find the hole better , but in terms of running with the ball or tracking ball carriers speed kills. Perhaps something moderates tackling angles, but my advances on that subject have led to little info.

In the testing league , looking at the run game was on the docket, but passing algorithms and man to coverage is the focus a the moment. .
I see.
Thanks for the info.
raymattison21 wrote:
3. Under game planning in miscellaneous you will find the game play agjustment, slow down, and hurry up. They all effect offensive play call outcomes. I run 21 gpa, 7 hu, and 7 sd. A zero setting should call most of your plays .
It's NOT LOGIC to need to do ANYTHING in that part to get no short plays in downs which are set to ZERO in the part where percentages are chosen...
That sim part and setting is OPPOSITE to logic :) because when have got a SHORTER than average for the chosen play, then the following ones need to be EXTRA LONG compared to average. This need an own topic :) I have thought of that logic error before, but I thought this was an OTHER thing, a bug.
raymattison21 wrote:
4. Is player fatigue . The miscellaneous section allows you to adjust when you want a position group pulled due to fatigue . By setting the depth chart deep and using overrides is a great way to keep guys fresh.
Fatigue after a few minutes?? :)

If I remember corect the 3rd player was chosen allready in the 3rd or 4th play,
and the 4th player in the list was chosen a few minutes later sure still in first quarter.

Re: Why oh why??? huhu :)

By raymattison21
11/04/2018 8:23 am
1. I understand now. Yeah returns are a bit off. Yes, a 20 yard return is good, but a td. would be better . Right now it tough to get a good return , and really it's only a blocked kick ,if you get close enough to tackle the punter .

Both allowing a td and blocking a punt is pretty hard to do under our current engine, so kicking a line drive in that situation would work , but it would be an exploit. The return game has been tweaked in the past to level of tds being ridiculously overpowered to current where averages are OK but tds are not.

3. This one could use a separate topic as I am not completely sure of the problem.

The developer is open to new ideas but the game play adjustment allows me to mix up my gameplan by using the different sets of plays in different senerios at different times. In terms of passing I could be throwing a short pass in a long situation. With three guys are still going deep on that particular play, and say it's a 3rd and 13 , this call is a formidable choice. Same as if had a long play with 2 guys going deep.

Yes, looking deep is the obvious choice, but if a defense has some great dbs sometimes hitting the te or RB will get you more yards. This starts to fall into a subjective range as secret strategy is at work cause coaches would be at a handicap to divulge their tactics to a possible opponent.

My team in the beta test league is throwing less than 20 % long passes which is low for me . In the past long passes favored fast players. Currently , nerfs are in place to normalize numbers, but passing is tough to relate to the real world at the visual level. Still, much strategy is involved and elite users use rules to call particular plays at certain times.

I use no rules, and get the plays I want run to at level I find acceptable . But it would not be without the settings available . It may not be intuitive but I am OK with them as my team is doing really well with the short passes by throwing to deep guys anyway or getting yards after they catch the ball on shorter routes .

These settings are tricky but AI choices are considered a "safe" strategy in terms of here or the nfl. Safe also means predicable. Rules change alot, and both sections could have pages of documentation . Seth guides are the best current information as many users obsevations / questions are similar to yours.

If your getting plays called outside of you game plan that is a bug . Recently , I have only seen this caused by using zeros in the game plan and high settings in the slow down section.

4. Simply said yes, but I could go on for hours on this subject and how our game relates to the real world. But here its pretty simple the farther a player travels , depending his weight and rest time between plays, dictates fatigue levels.

Really all these are great observations, and with knowledge of how the game works in relation to real life is the way our suggestions can make this game great!

Re: Why oh why??? huhu :)

By Lunkan
11/05/2018 7:00 pm
raymattison21 wrote:
3....
If your getting plays called outside of you game plan that is a bug . Recently , I have only seen this caused by using zeros in the game plan and high settings in the slow down section.
ok. Then I make a topic of this part in Bug section :)