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Main - General MFN Discussion

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By setherick
4/19/2016 7:44 pm
jdavidbakr wrote:

* If you have a heavy run game plan and go into hurry up, your QB and receivers are more fresh than they otherwise would be.
* If you have a heavy run game plan and go into slow down, your RB and OL might be more fatigued than they otherwise would be.


This still doesn't add up in the game that I played.

My opponent ran 28 passing plays and 14 running plays through three quarters. Using this logic, his receivers should have been fatiguing by the fourth quarter, and they suddenly became dominant.

So maybe the time of possession plays a factor? Nope. My team held the ball for 28:12 through three quarters to my opponents 16:48. My defense should have been as fresh as his offense.

I didn't get the point that jsid was making about hurry up being "great". Also, does changing play selection mean that the offense suddenly starts exploiting a defensive game plan by calling longer passes against running sets? What does that even mean?

It would really help if (1) we knew what a "pass" defensive set was per the code and (2) could control our prevent defenses through rules or game planning.

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
4/19/2016 8:13 pm
Your defense will call its plays when the offense is in hurry up just like it would any normal play, which is basically:

1) The offense calls the play. (If in hurry up it is 100% pass unless they are trying to consume some clock before an imminent go-ahead field goal)
2) The defense calls a play attempting to match the offensive formation. If the offense comes out in a 5-WR set, your defense will try to come out with 5 DBs and work its way down until it finds a play that has that secondary package. If you only have one play in your active playbook with 5 DBs, you will call that play every time the offense has 5 WRs.
3) You can override both #1 and #2 using gameplan rules.

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By setherick
4/19/2016 8:19 pm
jdavidbakr wrote:

3) You can override both #1 and #2 using gameplan rules.


Missed this originally caught it when I looked at the rules again.

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By CCSAHARA
4/19/2016 10:07 pm
I may be getting old but In 1975 the St. Louis Cardinals under Don Coryell the "Cardiac Cardinals" won seven times in the game's last minute.[ a great year to be a kid and Cardinal fan] Still can’t stand Bidwell and the Arizona Cardinals for leaving. [ I guess I hold a grudge] I also think that was the year the OL only gave up 7 sacks ALL season. Dobler, Young, Banks, Dierdorf, Finnie and TE Jackie Smith. What a line!

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By ARealKid
4/22/2016 8:23 pm
I remember in MFN-15, in the 2019 championship game,
Me, Tennessee vs War Eagle Dallas

He was up 35-0 at the start of the 4th quarter. Next thing we know, 3 minutes to go with my possession and it was 35-28. Too bad we blew the comeback and didn't win but hey it was still a great effort by Tennessee
Last edited at 4/22/2016 8:25 pm

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By setherick
4/22/2016 8:32 pm
I posted the bulk of this in my league forum, but reposting here.

My issue ended up being a total PEBKAC issue and resulted in a severe case of headdesk.

First, the hurry up rules are pretty janky if you don't use rules to counteract it. From what JDB has said in the main forums, the hurry up will switch to all passing, which causes the defense to call plays that match the passing sets. I assume -- and I haven't confirmed this assumption -- that this also means that your defensive play calling matrix and defensive play calling percentages are still respected. This will lead to a situation where your defense is calling running defensive sets against passing plays or calling weird exotic blitzes that leave you open for big gains down the field.

But, and here's the part that I missed before, you can counter this with proper defensive rules. How I missed that I could actually create defensive rules before I have no idea. Seriously. I use offensive rules...all...of...the...time. How did I miss the drop down? Don't ask me.

Realizing there are defensive rules have opened up my defensive play calling a lot.

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By WarEagle
4/23/2016 2:02 pm
ARealKid wrote:
I remember in MFN-15, in the 2019 championship game,
Me, Tennessee vs War Eagle Dallas

He was up 35-0 at the start of the 4th quarter. Next thing we know, 3 minutes to go with my possession and it was 35-28. Too bad we blew the comeback and didn't win but hey it was still a great effort by Tennessee


I remember that game. I may have had a meltdown if you had come back to win!

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By ARealKid
4/23/2016 11:35 pm
WarEagle wrote:
ARealKid wrote:
I remember in MFN-15, in the 2019 championship game,
Me, Tennessee vs War Eagle Dallas

He was up 35-0 at the start of the 4th quarter. Next thing we know, 3 minutes to go with my possession and it was 35-28. Too bad we blew the comeback and didn't win but hey it was still a great effort by Tennessee


I remember that game. I may have had a meltdown if you had come back to win!

For a back up QB to come back against a championship defense and score 4 touchdowns in the 4th quarter is impressive. However the following season he did start in the beginning and ended up being a bust and is now 4th string.

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By blackflys
4/24/2016 10:55 am
setherick wrote:
Gustoon wrote:
I know how frustrating this can be, I don't think any of us haven't had this happen to us, and I know it feels like its out of your hands, trust me there are individual players in and around this league that this doesn't happen too, have a look at their teams and try and get some tips.

To coin and old phrase, its not how you start, its how you finish.


I understand there are things I can do to help keep these from happening, but I've done a number of those things already. I don't think anyone can survive having a team get to run 30 plays in a quarter when they had run 42 plays all game. If KC had kept the plays per quarter up for the whole game, it would have ended up in a 120 play game. Most games in our league are going 50-70 plays per game total.




See all that complaining and you turned around and used the same thing that beat your top defense . You figured out that the hurry up would not be stopped unless they had changed there defensive rules. What happened to you was exactly what you did to the rookie gm his 1st day as an owner.

Re: Fourth Quarter Comebacks are Dumb

By setherick
4/24/2016 12:13 pm
blackflys wrote:
setherick wrote:
Gustoon wrote:
I know how frustrating this can be, I don't think any of us haven't had this happen to us, and I know it feels like its out of your hands, trust me there are individual players in and around this league that this doesn't happen too, have a look at their teams and try and get some tips.

To coin and old phrase, its not how you start, its how you finish.


I understand there are things I can do to help keep these from happening, but I've done a number of those things already. I don't think anyone can survive having a team get to run 30 plays in a quarter when they had run 42 plays all game. If KC had kept the plays per quarter up for the whole game, it would have ended up in a 120 play game. Most games in our league are going 50-70 plays per game total.




See all that complaining and you turned around and used the same thing that beat your top defense . You figured out that the hurry up would not be stopped unless they had changed there defensive rules. What happened to you was exactly what you did to the rookie gm his 1st day as an owner.


We dealt with this in our league forums with me showing you the exact offensive rules I use in the fourth quarter so that I don't have to rely on hurry up except for the last 5:00 when onside kicks make sense. If there were rules for onside kicks, I'd just run them every time I play you.