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Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By Frankebasta
2/28/2018 6:40 pm
jdavidbakr wrote:
There's a reason that NFL teams don't do QB by committee, and it mostly has to do with rhythm and chemistry. The changes being implemented simulate the 'warm up' time a QB coming in off the bench must go through before hitting his stride.


I know I'm a newbie here.
I do not pretend to know how the game works in its hidden parts.

But.... don't you think there are more PRESSING needs to address rather than Two-QB offenses?
(which IMHO should be a tactical choice: Tom Landry, no less, tried it with Staubach and Meredith. It didn't last long)

I'm talking about RBs, workhorses, listed as WR to gain the extra point of speed? This is something which does not, and can not, exist in the NFL. I do not remember one RL player who started his career as a WR to become a feature RB.

One more issue, in MFN players are free to switch position! It ain't so in RL. If not on a limited basis. I'm trying to train a few CBs into DEs... it's against common sense, but as long as it's possible, why not?

Also, players here are playing out of position more or less all the time. It won't happen in RL without a severe penalty.

These issues, and more, are more impactful than a back up QB taking a few more snaps, and should be addressed asap.

Regards,

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By Kababmaster
2/28/2018 6:51 pm
As another poster mentioned on here, it's a choice decision.

Personally, I like to have my QB's fatigue lvl at about 50%. For me, thats the HIGHEST level on my fatigue scale, except for K or P. The reason I have the QB fatigue lvl so low is that I'm afraid that if he gets tired he might make a dumb throw, or a pick six. If you, JDB, are going to reduce the effectiveness of a player position, perhaps the most important position, then please expand it to ALL positions

Respectfully

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By setherick
2/28/2018 7:31 pm
It's worth noting that 0.4.3 will also address the root causes that caused the two-QB system to become a viable option:

1) QB fatigue is being adjusted - a QB can now throw more passes without being tired.
2) QBs will make decisions faster
3) WRs will use route running more effectively reducing the need to run an all SP, all go offense

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By lellow2011
2/28/2018 9:05 pm
jdavidbakr wrote:
There's a reason that NFL teams don't do QB by committee, and it mostly has to do with rhythm and chemistry. The changes being implemented simulate the 'warm up' time a QB coming in off the bench must go through before hitting his stride.


Actually, it probably has more to do with how much of the cap starting QBs typically get paid, and the lack of quality NFL quarterbacks. Every team would love to have 2 starting caliber QBs, the financial aspect of the game simply doesn't support it. Not to mention the amount of practice time that each team has and the majority of those 1st team reps go to the starter.

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By Kababmaster
2/28/2018 9:35 pm
setherick wrote:
It's worth noting that 0.4.3 will also address the root causes that caused the two-QB system to become a viable option:

1) QB fatigue is being adjusted - a QB can now throw more passes without being tired.
2) QBs will make decisions faster
3) WRs will use route running more effectively reducing the need to run an all SP, all go offense


Cool, now give me the 65-75% running game aspect of the game. (?) Will EVERY position be reduced like the QB position ?
Last edited at 2/28/2018 9:38 pm

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By setherick
2/28/2018 9:40 pm
Kababmaster wrote:
setherick wrote:
It's worth noting that 0.4.3 will also address the root causes that caused the two-QB system to become a viable option:

1) QB fatigue is being adjusted - a QB can now throw more passes without being tired.
2) QBs will make decisions faster
3) WRs will use route running more effectively reducing the need to run an all SP, all go offense


Cool, now give me the 65-75% running game aspect of the game. (?) Will EVERY position be reduced like the QB position ?


I have no idea what this means. The changes in beta (MFN-1 and Beta-87) make QBs significantly better.

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By Kababmaster
2/28/2018 9:46 pm
setherick wrote:
Kababmaster wrote:
setherick wrote:
It's worth noting that 0.4.3 will also address the root causes that caused the two-QB system to become a viable option:

1) QB fatigue is being adjusted - a QB can now throw more passes without being tired.
2) QBs will make decisions faster
3) WRs will use route running more effectively reducing the need to run an all SP, all go offense


Cool, now give me the 65-75% running game aspect of the game. (?) Will EVERY position be reduced like the QB position ?


I have no idea what this means. The changes in beta (MFN-1 and Beta-87) make QBs significantly better.


The originator of the game wishes to cut the #2 QB by way of reducing his effectiveness. My beef is that, if this can happen, then it should be extended across the board at all positions and not just QB.
Last edited at 2/28/2018 9:47 pm

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By setherick
2/28/2018 10:07 pm
Kababmaster wrote:
setherick wrote:
Kababmaster wrote:
setherick wrote:
It's worth noting that 0.4.3 will also address the root causes that caused the two-QB system to become a viable option:

1) QB fatigue is being adjusted - a QB can now throw more passes without being tired.
2) QBs will make decisions faster
3) WRs will use route running more effectively reducing the need to run an all SP, all go offense


Cool, now give me the 65-75% running game aspect of the game. (?) Will EVERY position be reduced like the QB position ?


I have no idea what this means. The changes in beta (MFN-1 and Beta-87) make QBs significantly better.


The originator of the game wishes to cut the #2 QB by way of reducing his effectiveness. My beef is that, if this can happen, then it should be extended across the board at all positions and not just QB.


That's not the point of the change at all. The point is to make a single QB system work as well as a convoy QB system. Right now, QBs hit a fatigue threshold at 20 throws (which is why you see so many games where a QB goes 16/20 in the first half and 6/20 in the second half). Convoying QBs exploits this QB fatigue threshold by keeping QBs as near full fatigue. This allows a convoy QB team deploy three mediocre QBs and outperform a team with a 100 everything QB because the 100 everything QB will hit a fatigue threshold. With the other changes being deployed in 0.4.3, QBs will play more realistically than they do now.

To the points above, the reason you do not see convoy QB systems in the NFL is two fold:

1) As JDB said, QBs need to be on the field to develop game chemistry with their receivers. They are always reading the defenses and the adjustments a defense makes over the course of the game. If they are constantly being rotated through, it adds too much cognitive load to make these decisions effectively.

2) Most importantly, there are not that many starting quality QBs in the NFL at any given point. We are in the most pass prolific period of the NFL where QBs are better protected and playing longer. And, even then, there are only a handful of players in the league that be starters in your average MFN league. QB generation in MFN is skewed badly so that every league gets filled full of 100 Accuracy QBs within a few years of a league or at least good accuracy and good other passing attributes.

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By Kababmaster
2/28/2018 10:19 pm
That's not the point of the change at all. The point is to make a single QB system work .....
...< Why ? Can we not have a single RB system ?

This is MFN, not NFL....perhaps the game might evolve into something else, who knows(?) I will tell you, with comfort, that squeezing on one position to a misnomer, perhaps the most important position, is not very attractive and ultimately promotes a line of distract.

Re: 2 QBs starters ?

By raymattison21
3/01/2018 7:18 am
Kababmaster wrote:
That's not the point of the change at all. The point is to make a single QB system work .....
...< Why ? Can we not have a single RB system ?

This is MFN, not NFL....perhaps the game might evolve into something else, who knows(?) I will tell you, with comfort, that squeezing on one position to a misnomer, perhaps the most important position, is not very attractive and ultimately promotes a line of distract.


Running is off. Height is not used in this game which messes with speed and endurance . Not to mention leverage and strength . A guy loses weight and gains speed but doesn't lose strength? Or power ? Fatigue ratings are tied directly to weight.....it just doesn't work that way IRL. A convoy system works for RBs here cause of that. There are similarities but using big guys . ..or tying to wear down a defense in order to hit a home run just doesn't work .

Forte had the fastest play last year.22.3 mph something like that ...240 pounds at six foot...I don't think our 240 pounders run over 20 mph probably not even 18 mph.

You think too hard about position switches. You got think of getting he ratings where you want.

Still, guys losing weight and gaining weight is off as well. That should be tied to height, but a real life player have gained 60 to 80 pounds while in the nfl.

Tedious is the methods to win.....but for qb this change is simple. Rotating other postions actually works in the nfl, be cause players are fresh . Lactic acidosis is your enemy, but for qbs that real life threshold is rarely reached. Dbs and wrs run miles a games. Oline and qbs cover little ground. Maybe cam newton, but it's no comparison and he is tall which makes him lean and more efficient at ridding his body of this lactic acid.

Right now this is the closest we got to that. Stops have to be added to fit this linear system of fatigue/ speed ratings