Right now, it seems to be way too effective a strategy to play many players out of position for speed gains. WR's are better RB's than RB's, CB's are better S's than S's, S's are better LB's than LB's, and so on. I've seen a team very effectively using WR's as CB's and getting a ton of picks, I assume due to the high pass catching attribute. It is not any fun when you have an owner take over and dominate a league using these exploits, when you are interested in playing an actual sim realistically. I hope that this can be addressed in a meaningful way soon.

Not in this league but I lurk on the forums sometimes to see what you all are talking about. This is a huge bug IMO and needs to be fixed. Everyone does it, so why not just make roster minimums?

Another issue I have is drafting a DL and converting him to DB or something. I am fine with position changes, but as long as they are realistic. LB>DL is ok, FB>TE, etc... but a 300 DL to a DB? Needs to get fixed.

Its a little deeper than that. the speed we function with is similar to a highschool team. 4.7z fourty to 9 sec 40 yard dash. this is physics, and not taking gambles on out of position players would be pointless. it would force us to use even slower guys, when 80% of them are too slow anyway

and to say these position switches are not real doesnt make sense either. problem is nflers gain and lose 100 pounds more often than not. guys just start this regimen in highschool or earlier and dont lose the weight untill they are done.

you just dont see it often in the public eye. eating and exercising that much is super unhealthy and i do not recommend it. but I for the love of the game or the money , some guys, need to do this to maintain a desired weight. but its not easy or sutainable as here.

concussions are bad but the body cant handle these health demands to change weight and alot of great nflers do it to play the game. we have no health concerns to deal with here besides a weak injury rate.

jdb has made this part of the game tougher, but still alot of my guys come out of position. but thats cause most ownwers draft all the good players at the position. i like to think of it as a project player or a sleeper , who just may never get there. those guys already at a desired weight are more nfl ready. thats how i see it...

until the whole system runs off scale using body mass index speed will be somewhat of an issue, but i complained for years to align these parts to slow said exploits.

if a 5'9 225 pound db is converted to dt he will probablyget to 275 pounds if not more. now hes real stocky. here he functions (physiological) as if he were 6"7. that part is so off and changes there would curtail alot of this stuff and put it more in line with the weight changes the college and pro experience in the early parts of thier career. but many guys are 210 to 230 and end up near 300 and once they retire they almost immediately lose all that weight again. see they are never going to get much faster irl but they can get stronger.

see there is no way to pull these guys out without proper weights or knowing where to look, but i will routinely search for under weight dlinemen as early as the late first....in order to land a possible good db.

. good or bad i think of it like both the player and his highschool/college coaches never saw his potential , and now they are on a fast track.

running here is super tied to speed, but but blocking is a joke and probably could be rewritten. whers my gap integrity... wheres my different blocking schemes? if we had run pass options the results would be hilarious.

and alot of nfler could easily play both sides of the ball. yes it takes time to learn a position, but wrs picking off ***** is the new passing algorithms. passing has been beat since and anyone standing near the target could pick it off.

but ball carry has to so vauble cause blocking is weak, and this wr will take that pick back for a td because of it. that part bothers me more than him picking it off. these wrs are playing cb are taking advantage of the horrid reads to the 3rd options and on. i dont see them playing cb2 and winning games

take off the tag of the position...everyone trends to the same weight anyway. that part is even less real. you dont really need maxed out positional experience to be effective, and with the lack of creative plays welcomes setting guys out of position kind of making different matchups ...simulating nfl stlyes with a bit of imagination added in.

i stiil got issues with sub 6 foot linemen. sometimes i wont draft them just cause its so ridiculous, but we use highschool speed ranges and fatigue...why not have a highschool sized lineman.

i remember one of our HS nose tackles was like 5 foot 6 and like 170. he was a great wrestler then, strong ,quick and explosive. pretty good but i couldn't believe how small he was even at that level bu tstill be effective . too bad his football career was over...this game he might be a pro if he could gain 100 pounds.

physiological terms , hed be too fat or too muscular for the size of his liver...your liver is never going to grow...it can be more efficient, but theres a clear limit not defined here.

You seem to have completely missed what I was getting at. I have no problem with switching a players position after drafting him, I do this all the time and it's very useful and doesn't seem too unrealistic to me. What I have a problem with is managers who take their RB's, who they only ever intend on playing as RB's, and list them as WR's so that they are faster. Some teams will have no RB's on their roster. The big issue is that this works for them. A player with a true WR body would not be able to be a successful NFL RB for an extended period of time. There is a reason RB's have the size that they do, and the code here misses it completely. These guys should be getting far fewer yards after contact than they are, and they should not be nearly as durable taking the pounding that a RB takes with a WR body.

I was adding a bit as there is other reasons across the whole game that have similar oddities. The height of the player is what make the position change unrealistic.

You have to ingore height here as there are numerous 200 pound RBs who have done well in the NFL. They are all sub 6 foot ...it's the lack not using body mass index here.(weight/hieght=BMI).

Guys here have a frame but i got 6'7 RBs at 217 pounds. IRL he would be injured quick, cause he is taller, but he would have potential for better endurance. Our code uses breaktackle and velocity angles to generate an actual broken tackle. that right there severly ties it to speed/mobilty/weight changes.

But I like to think of it having two types of broken tackles even though it looks similar in the game veiwer. One driven by the actual break tackle rating, but the more common one....a defender getting only a hand on the RB just cause too shifty. (angles and velocities of the two guys)

i have played the game using my own height limitations....ones tha t fit nfl BMIs and that right there limited who i had to choose from. Its the only "root cause" solution here. One that alot of these unrealistic switches any styles of play.

It would help with cluster injuries, align speed across all positions, adjust fatigue rates, and help with numerous exploitable oddities. Wouldn't be perfect but grossly better for future adjustments.

OK, maybe I just misunderstood or oversimplified your point. Thanks.

There is a penalty for playing a player out of his assigned position - should that penalty be increased? I don't want it to be so severe that you can't play a player out of position if you have to, but perhaps the penalty is not great enough.

I cross-train players constantly. First, so that I can substitute more often than most. I put time and effort into it, it's a large part of my system, and I've built successful teams around doing it.

Second, because I want WRs that know how to break a tackle and block downfield. I want defenders that can throw a good block and hands that can tackle after turnovers. I want to mold ST players that effectively fill the positions they take for ST play. IRL, break-the-mold guys aren't born as break-the-mold guys. It takes dedication. I can't simulate that experience without OOP play.

Yes, I care about speed, too. The speed equalizing tweak should reduce the effectiveness of putting players on an OOP weight-loss diet. I vote we try that and see how much before we add another penalty to OOP play on top of it.

I really don't feel that penalizing it is the answer. I think the goal needs to be that naturally in the code, it doesn't make sense to play a WR at RB consistently because he is not going to produce because he does not have the body type to be effective at that position consistently. I think a good start towards this is making strength and size of both players in a tackling interaction more important than it currently seems to be. The health issue is another one that would need to be looked into. I don't know how injuries work on the back end, but it seems to me they should be more tied to consistently being involved in collisions and body type. A guy with a WR body should never make it through a full season healthy taking the kind of hits a RB takes.

I think i could work around this. It would be a harder but i could still get a player to be my desired weight and still have no out of position penalty for more important games.

I would definitely have no problem with a stronger penalty if i could set a desired weight. There would have to be a balance.