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Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
4/28/2020 11:46 am
This has the update to the blocking algorithm to change the impact of weight difference to be exponential.

The most important feedback is to see if it's too strong or too weak - i.e. if you have a large or small lineman (offense or defense) do they dominate beyond what their skills should indicate. I don't want weight difference to be the deciding factor.

Also wanting to make find out if the punt blocking hack is reduced or eliminated from this update.
Last edited at 4/28/2020 11:47 am

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By raymattison21
5/16/2020 11:35 am
Quick early analysis puts strength higher on the list for pass rushing skills. Dropping is the value of weight and the actual pass rushing skill cause bigger guys are getting into postion a bit easier.

Sacks and pressures are low to begin with even though qbs are not reallly running.

On the punt block front we got close once with a 95 speed DB playing DE. He faced a fast C with 55 pass block...the db had 14 pass rush. The strong C held his own most of the time

Our other punt block tactic was a 210 pound 93 speed 99 pass rush convert facing another veteran C playing LG. He had 68 speed and much better acceleration than 73 pound lighter player and a 100 pass block with veteran experience compared to the rookie convert .This C got beat but enough was there to hold that weakside of the line for no chance of a punt block.

Flip it to us punting and our 73 speed LT was beat enough by stronger and quicker players but pressure was just never going to get there before the kick was made.

Around the league a CB punted 6 times and a set of DL or maybe some LBers only got close to him....no blocks there either. Put a fast guy vs a non punter and we will probably see some blocks, but thats only under theory till someone posts one.

I saw a small effect to the whole game.... especially pass rushing, but in theory agian , this change was to the weight factor of pass rushing, which is a part of the overall blocking algorithms......so wouldn't run blocking change a bit as well?

I saw that there was only five runs over 20 yards this preseason week 1. Are Blockers in the run game getting in to postion differently now due to this change or is it specified to pass rushing only?

Any ways good stuff .....its nice to see some code changes again!


Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By raymattison21
5/19/2020 6:49 am
https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11339#2083026

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By raymattison21
5/19/2020 7:19 am
raymattison21 wrote:
https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11339#2083026


95 speed 191 pound db getting past an olineman at 312pounds 48 speed 75 acc. with 95 pass blocking. The snapper had 84 long snapping skills and the punter had timing in the 90s, but one thing i did different was load up the front 4 with "true" speed and thats it. Despite the lack of a pass rushing skill these guys had to just buzz by the larger oline.

A TE playing LG ,on that same play, was beat by a wr.... coincidentally the upback picked him up allowing a clean shot at the punter. Other punts under this same set of conditions had the Dt stay blocked long enough the beat LT was saved by the upback swinging over.

In other words it helps to have all fast guys for the dline so the up back is occupied. This TE at 257 pounds had 79 speed and 99 pass block was still too slow playing guard where the pass rushing angle is not even as easy as the DE.

This is a punt return play not a punt block...so the offense is still at a disadvantage to this tactic

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By raymattison21
5/20/2020 8:57 am
https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11353#2085670

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
5/20/2020 9:08 am
Yes, pass blocking has the greatest impact but run blocking would have been impacted as well by this update.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By raymattison21
5/20/2020 9:11 am
raymattison21 wrote:
https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11353#2085670



Arizona ran a K at punter and had one blocked by a 237 pound LB out of the RDE spot, but here on this play the cb playing punter had one blocked by a 245 pound LB the same way .

Both vs non punters and both Lbers were not slow so i am not sure if this qualifies as needing to be fixed.

Still, the interesting part of this play was the blocker....a 198 pound wr playing LT with below average strength and speed but 82 pass block. The LBer had 99 pass rush and 93 strength, which could have caused the little resistance in the blocking engagement.....or was he too slow as well?

Touching on speed a breakaway run by a 54 speed 217 pound player was clocked at a 5.7 second fourty yard dash while a counter part weighing in at 191 with 67 speed ran him down running a fourty a full second faster and near top speed in the game with a 4.7?

So, a 90 speed guy runs a 4.7 and so does 70....well that the way i see it most of the time now, and a 50 speed RB should be at least a 4.7 or something not a 5.7

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By TarquinTheDark
5/21/2020 8:57 pm
I put the full PB lineup in this game ...

Had one block on the first of seven attempts:
https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11358#2086606

LE #46 Carl Perez beats
#64 John Potts and #52 Jose Peters
He's not fast for a SS, but they're slow.
and
RE #42 Ted Lutz beats
#62 Abel Cerrato 61 SP LT and #82 Juan Letorneau 56 SP TE
Last edited at 5/21/2020 9:06 pm

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By raymattison21
5/22/2020 5:36 am
TarquinTheDark wrote:
I put the full PB lineup in this game ...

Had one block on the first of seven attempts:
https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11358#2086606

LE #46 Carl Perez beats
#64 John Potts and #52 Jose Peters
He's not fast for a SS, but they're slow.
and
RE #42 Ted Lutz beats
#62 Abel Cerrato 61 SP LT and #82 Juan Letorneau 56 SP TE


EVen the RG/LDT interaction is distrubing. 88spd at 191pounds blows past 76spd at 217 pounds with 100 pass block. That db had only 10% addition speed and 30 pounds in his favor. Maybe these blockers are starting out just a split second too slow?

Even the 67 speed SS beating a 75 speed RG.....at 100 pounds of weight difference what else could be the deciding factor? 20 points of pass blocking?

I know a G will have a slower 40 time than a SS but for that RB not even to get out of his stance to attempt a pass block seems like the culprit. Its as if the blockers loss the battle right outthe gates. Could a 191 pound eilte speed elite pass blocking guy stop a lesser player most of the time?

Maybe position experience or just a random effect to how quickly guys react to different snaps is driving the final outcome?

My block was early in the game as well....Just the fact they are fresher give that boost on a more consistent basis. Still seems like a real small window with too many irregular results. Theres a pattern of speed and size going on but i would think even that would be more consistent if that were to completly blame...

In 40 tests on kickoffs the first few feet of the race was very close and quite random..but does that even relate to the ability for linemen to get out of there stance at the snap...except thats the range were working in here...a few feet a most

Re: [0.4.6] Version 7bae3754

By raymattison21
5/23/2020 11:48 am
https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11371#2089577