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Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By lellow2011
5/23/2016 9:34 am
oukjweather wrote:
jdavidbakr wrote:
I rewrote some algorithms with the passing game. I've done limited testing but am happy with what I see so far. A couple of points with this update:

* The sack where the QB runs to the sideline should be eliminated
* Offensive line should pass protect better, and the pass rush/pass block attributes should have a greater impact
* Defense Ends and Offensive Tackles, when engaged, are now also considering speed (acceleration + max speed) as the DE will do more speed rushing.
* QB passing accuracy bar carries a bit more weight than it did previously. QB's with 50-rated accuracy should no longer do as well as they have.

My limited testing indicates that this has reduced the sack rate, and the top QBs are more directly related to their ratings. I welcome your feedback as you watch the week 5 games.


I noticed improvement for my team in all of the above. My QB played one of his better games hitting a more respectable number of his passes given his passing accuracy and my DLine had one of its more impactful games given their ratings getting 3 sacks.


Weird that your Dline played better, mine had very little impact.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By raymattison21
5/23/2016 12:10 pm
Looking through the games. The atl game had the most sacks like 15 and i think one game had none between both teams. Most teams had 2 or 3 sacks total.

For players the sacks seemed like evenly distributed throughout all positions. Definitely a drop for speedy DEs and DEs in general. Though the top sacker was a DE with 3. One trend was most sackers had high pass rush.

Another trend was qbs taking off and getting sacked on the scramble. Dbs wracked up some that way. IRL perhaps the QB would have thrown it away.

Also, noting the atl game where a good line gave up alot of sacks, was most of the plays where sacks took place I had noticed lack of extra blockers could have had an effect. Only looking at the log it seemed lt seems the qbs ability to read the Blitz and coverages might be lacking . They can throw well under pressure so perhaps that is the balance. But this game has always been like that.

Some game plans will change in the future varying the stats seen today but in general this change is welcomed. Peter Davis QB went for 74 yards on the ground. I think that is awesome. But still seeing a few DEs do well and even some DTs wracking more than one sack was enough for me.

There was too many DB sacks but I think that is the qbs decision not to throw it away. Not from DB blitzes being too effective. But we will see as gameplans change. Nice work JDB!

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By lellow2011
5/23/2016 12:18 pm
raymattison21 wrote:
Looking through the games. The atl game had the most sacks like 15 and i think one game had none between both teams. Most teams had 2 or 3 sacks total.

For players the sacks seemed like evenly distributed throughout all positions. Definitely a drop for speedy DEs and DEs in general. Though the top sacker was a DE with 3. One trend was most sackers had high pass rush.

Another trend was qbs taking off and getting sacked on the scramble. Dbs wracked up some that way. IRL perhaps the QB would have thrown it away.

Also, noting the atl game where a good line gave up alot of sacks, was most of the plays where sacks took place I had noticed lack of extra blockers could have had an effect. Only looking at the log it seemed lt seems the qbs ability to read the Blitz and coverages might be lacking . They can throw well under pressure so perhaps that is the balance. But this game has always been like that.

Some game plans will change in the future varying the stats seen today but in general this change is welcomed. Peter Davis QB went for 74 yards on the ground. I think that is awesome. But still seeing a few DEs do well and even some DTs wracking more than one sack was enough for me.

There was too many DB sacks but I think that is the qbs decision not to throw it away. Not from DB blitzes being too effective. But we will see as gameplans change. Nice work JDB!


With the way WRs catch the ball anyway in double coverage there isn't much point in dropping 8 guys. I feel the DB sacks is more a product of people's play calling. I know that personally I bring CBs and Safeties on the blitz a good amount. They really didn't seem to be getting to teh QB very much though in this one.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By ibblacklavender02
5/23/2016 1:34 pm
lellow2011 wrote:
raymattison21 wrote:
Looking through the games. The atl game had the most sacks like 15 and i think one game had none between both teams. Most teams had 2 or 3 sacks total.

For players the sacks seemed like evenly distributed throughout all positions. Definitely a drop for speedy DEs and DEs in general. Though the top sacker was a DE with 3. One trend was most sackers had high pass rush.

Another trend was qbs taking off and getting sacked on the scramble. Dbs wracked up some that way. IRL perhaps the QB would have thrown it away.

Also, noting the atl game where a good line gave up alot of sacks, was most of the plays where sacks took place I had noticed lack of extra blockers could have had an effect. Only looking at the log it seemed lt seems the qbs ability to read the Blitz and coverages might be lacking . They can throw well under pressure so perhaps that is the balance. But this game has always been like that.

Some game plans will change in the future varying the stats seen today but in general this change is welcomed. Peter Davis QB went for 74 yards on the ground. I think that is awesome. But still seeing a few DEs do well and even some DTs wracking more than one sack was enough for me.

There was too many DB sacks but I think that is the qbs decision not to throw it away. Not from DB blitzes being too effective. But we will see as gameplans change. Nice work JDB!


With the way WRs catch the ball anyway in double coverage there isn't much point in dropping 8 guys. I feel the DB sacks is more a product of people's play calling. I know that personally I bring CBs and Safeties on the blitz a good amount. They really didn't seem to be getting to the QB very much though in this one.


Yeah I ended up being the team with 10 sacks....Basically when the QB took off to scramble I was either in a zone or my players somehow knew the qb would be taking off and met him before he got to the line.....I actually believe the Qb had like 100 in speed too....My safteys got a few sacks like that and so did my LB...I like the fact that my players met the QB before he crossed the line but yeah in the NFL the QB would just throw it away...Not sure if this is possible but I would love it if the QB could take off to get some space and still throw the ball...But that might end up being too much....I did see 2 plays where I thought the QB was sacked for sure and he threw a dart for a big gain...But no complaints....I was going to ask if the DB play was improved since the QB play was but this 97 ranked QB had a terrible game against my team....10 sacks and 3 picks

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By lellow2011
5/23/2016 1:42 pm
ibblacklavender02 wrote:
lellow2011 wrote:
raymattison21 wrote:
Looking through the games. The atl game had the most sacks like 15 and i think one game had none between both teams. Most teams had 2 or 3 sacks total.

For players the sacks seemed like evenly distributed throughout all positions. Definitely a drop for speedy DEs and DEs in general. Though the top sacker was a DE with 3. One trend was most sackers had high pass rush.

Another trend was qbs taking off and getting sacked on the scramble. Dbs wracked up some that way. IRL perhaps the QB would have thrown it away.

Also, noting the atl game where a good line gave up alot of sacks, was most of the plays where sacks took place I had noticed lack of extra blockers could have had an effect. Only looking at the log it seemed lt seems the qbs ability to read the Blitz and coverages might be lacking . They can throw well under pressure so perhaps that is the balance. But this game has always been like that.

Some game plans will change in the future varying the stats seen today but in general this change is welcomed. Peter Davis QB went for 74 yards on the ground. I think that is awesome. But still seeing a few DEs do well and even some DTs wracking more than one sack was enough for me.

There was too many DB sacks but I think that is the qbs decision not to throw it away. Not from DB blitzes being too effective. But we will see as gameplans change. Nice work JDB!


With the way WRs catch the ball anyway in double coverage there isn't much point in dropping 8 guys. I feel the DB sacks is more a product of people's play calling. I know that personally I bring CBs and Safeties on the blitz a good amount. They really didn't seem to be getting to the QB very much though in this one.


Yeah I ended up being the team with 10 sacks....Basically when the QB took off to scramble I was either in a zone or my players somehow knew the qb would be taking off and met him before he got to the line.....I actually believe the Qb had like 100 in speed too....My safteys got a few sacks like that and so did my LB...I like the fact that my players met the QB before he crossed the line but yeah in the NFL the QB would just throw it away...Not sure if this is possible but I would love it if the QB could take off to get some space and still throw the ball...But that might end up being too much....I did see 2 plays where I thought the QB was sacked for sure and he threw a dart for a big gain...But no complaints....I was going to ask if the DB play was improved since the QB play was but this 97 ranked QB had a terrible game against my team....10 sacks and 3 picks


I didn't really see this behavior has the team I was against didn't have their QB scramble really at all.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By Black Adder
5/23/2016 2:14 pm
Tecra031 wrote:
Same as above...more scrambling from my QB, which is better...but no sacks or real pressure at all on the opposing QB.


agree with Tecra here.

My D Line which has brought preasure all sesaon just didn`t this game,maybe GB`s D Line is really good.
This is ok ,IF the QB doesn`t just pass for 400 plus yards like how it used to be,with great D Lineman getting no preasure,there needs to be a balance.

I`m happy that QB`s take off downfield now (looks like I may have a good one at doing this),but if we`re not careful the QB will become the most potent rushing option for an offence.

Also if fatique is measured the same as all other players and your QB is set at 100,he will be on the field every play,so he`s programmed to try and run when he`s obviosly knackered ,so I can see lots of QB fumbles and injuries.

Also a QB`s intelligence rating should have a imput on if and when he runs,it shouldn`t be set in stone for ALL QB`s,under preasure,always run.

obviously it`s only 1 game,much better to see how it looks after another 5 or 6 games.

As I said previously thanks for really putting in the effort to make this game better and better,god how much better the game is than when I first started playing 8 game seasons ago.

Thank You JDB.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By Wolfpack
5/23/2016 2:15 pm
All of my sacks came from either a blitzing LB or from clean up on the QB roll outs by a CB or LB.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By Black Adder
5/25/2016 4:04 am
JDB,

Do QB`s slide and give them-selves up on under preasure run scrambles or do they have to be tackled and brought down like RB`s?

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By lellow2011
5/25/2016 4:19 am
The Cincinnati versus Houston sim was just total garbage. My QB has 98/100 accuracy and couldn't complete nearly anything until the 4th quarter, my WRs simply were not making plays in 1v1 coverage. Yet Houston has a QB with 77 accuracy and they guy can't miss anything, 23/25 for 294 yards... just utter ****. I have 2 CBs starting with maxed out man coverage abilities and great speed/acceleration and Intelligence. The penalties are just out of hand I feel, my defense had 3 turnovers created overturned by penalties. (2 of these were against 2 of the best CBs in the league with max discipline).

https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/player/8523 - 100 man coverage, 88 speed, 77 acceleration. Gave up 9 catches on 13 targets - not sure how that stat is possible when Houston's QB only had 2 incompletions

https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/player/10855 - 97/98 man coverage, 96 speed, 98 acceleration, 100 int. - 5 catches allowed on 5 targets

Yet... this guy.... https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/player/9698 - 37/38 man coverage, 84 speed, 61 acceleration and 15 zone coverage - gives up ONE catch on 7 targets. And with 98 accuracy it's not like my QB was just missing the mark.

It's like football skill ratings mean absolutely nothing.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
5/25/2016 8:30 am
Here are the factors that influence QB accuracy:

1) their accuracy rating (duh)
2) experience and fatigue
3) if the QB is moving, their scramble skill (the faster they are moving, the more their scramble skill comes into play)
4) the distance the ball is being thrown - further distances have less accuracy. This is the only tweak I made recently, previously there was no distance penalty for passes shorter than 15 yards, I changed that because too many bad QB's were playing like superstars with the short passing game. It's possible this still needs to be tweaked.
5) Pressure from the defensive line

So you can't completely evaluate everything by the accuracy rating, if your QB is under a lot of pressure or is throwing longer passes it's going to show up in his accuracy. I'd be interested to see if you evaluate the performance with those additional factors in mind and still think the scales seemed tilted too much.

As for the defensive backs, their man-to-man coverage simply means how close they are able to stay with the WRs. But they must also have the speed to do it as well, if the WR is outrunning them then they won't be in a position to knock the ball down. That's a measure of their speed, acceleration, and weight.

Penalties haven't changed at all, if you're seeing an uptick in them the factors in that are primarily discipline with a lesser influence by fatigue and experience.