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Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
5/25/2016 8:30 am
Black Adder wrote:
JDB,

Do QB`s slide and give them-selves up on under preasure run scrambles or do they have to be tackled and brought down like RB`s?



No slide right now, that's something I do need to add but haven't gotten to it yet.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By lellow2011
5/25/2016 8:57 am
jdavidbakr wrote:
Here are the factors that influence QB accuracy:

1) their accuracy rating (duh)
2) experience and fatigue
3) if the QB is moving, their scramble skill (the faster they are moving, the more their scramble skill comes into play)
4) the distance the ball is being thrown - further distances have less accuracy. This is the only tweak I made recently, previously there was no distance penalty for passes shorter than 15 yards, I changed that because too many bad QB's were playing like superstars with the short passing game. It's possible this still needs to be tweaked.
5) Pressure from the defensive line

So you can't completely evaluate everything by the accuracy rating, if your QB is under a lot of pressure or is throwing longer passes it's going to show up in his accuracy. I'd be interested to see if you evaluate the performance with those additional factors in mind and still think the scales seemed tilted too much.

As for the defensive backs, their man-to-man coverage simply means how close they are able to stay with the WRs. But they must also have the speed to do it as well, if the WR is outrunning them then they won't be in a position to knock the ball down. That's a measure of their speed, acceleration, and weight.

Penalties haven't changed at all, if you're seeing an uptick in them the factors in that are primarily discipline with a lesser influence by fatigue and experience.


So assuming these CBs are right on top of the WR, which they were on most of these catches how does the DB combat the WR actually catching the ball? In the NFL if a WR is blanketed by a CB the QB will typically have to look elsewhere or they will tend to run out of time. It seems like in this sim that the QB simply doesn't care how well a WR is covered, that being the case it seems like M2M coverage isn't really all that important if you can't keep the WR from catching the ball anyway.
Last edited at 5/25/2016 9:02 am

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
5/25/2016 10:42 am
In the case of a WR being blanketed by the CB, the QB will either decide he is too well-covered or will try to throw the ball to a place that the CB cannot get to and the WR has the greatest chance to catch it. When the ball is thrown, the CB makes a decision whether he will attempt to knock the ball down, go for the INT, or realize he can't get there in time and try to make the tackle. If he chooses to try to make an INT, he is less likely to knock the ball down, and if he is unsuccessful at getting the ball in this case, the WR may have a better shot at making the catch. The punish receiver/courage attributes also come into play with the WR catchability.

A more experienced CB will be less likely to try to make an INT if it is an extremely close call than one who is less experienced, but also a less experienced CB will be more likely to let the WR catch the ball than try to make a play on it. It's complicated, I know ... and hard to really explain ... but that's kind of a basic overview of how it works.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By Tecra031
5/25/2016 10:58 am
Still no sacks or real pressure on the QB...KC/NJ had 0 sacks for either team and very little QB pressure for both teams.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By Wolfpack
5/25/2016 11:41 am
lellow2011 wrote:
jdavidbakr wrote:
Here are the factors that influence QB accuracy:

1) their accuracy rating (duh)
2) experience and fatigue
3) if the QB is moving, their scramble skill (the faster they are moving, the more their scramble skill comes into play)
4) the distance the ball is being thrown - further distances have less accuracy. This is the only tweak I made recently, previously there was no distance penalty for passes shorter than 15 yards, I changed that because too many bad QB's were playing like superstars with the short passing game. It's possible this still needs to be tweaked.
5) Pressure from the defensive line

So you can't completely evaluate everything by the accuracy rating, if your QB is under a lot of pressure or is throwing longer passes it's going to show up in his accuracy. I'd be interested to see if you evaluate the performance with those additional factors in mind and still think the scales seemed tilted too much.

As for the defensive backs, their man-to-man coverage simply means how close they are able to stay with the WRs. But they must also have the speed to do it as well, if the WR is outrunning them then they won't be in a position to knock the ball down. That's a measure of their speed, acceleration, and weight.

Penalties haven't changed at all, if you're seeing an uptick in them the factors in that are primarily discipline with a lesser influence by fatigue and experience.


So assuming these CBs are right on top of the WR, which they were on most of these catches how does the DB combat the WR actually catching the ball? In the NFL if a WR is blanketed by a CB the QB will typically have to look elsewhere or they will tend to run out of time. It seems like in this sim that the QB simply doesn't care how well a WR is covered, that being the case it seems like M2M coverage isn't really all that important if you can't keep the WR from catching the ball anyway.


Receivers in the NFL are rarely "open", its about ball placement by the QB and anticipation. I knows its frustrating to watch the dot who looks covered make a catch but you have to factor in some things you can't see in the replay.

The throws into double, triple or quad coverage are another story however.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By Wolfpack
5/25/2016 11:43 am
In the last sim, I did get some pressure from my DL (3 sacks) but the QB generally has all day to throw now. It seems like the roll out logic is sound but the OL/DL interaction may have went a tad too far?

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
5/25/2016 11:59 am
Wolfpack wrote:
In the last sim, I did get some pressure from my DL (3 sacks) but the QB generally has all day to throw now. It seems like the roll out logic is sound but the OL/DL interaction may have went a tad too far?


I agree, I'm going to make an adjustment hopefully by the next sim. I'm also adjusting some of the QB scrambling but the first round of that didn't test well.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By lellow2011
5/25/2016 12:16 pm
jdavidbakr wrote:
In the case of a WR being blanketed by the CB, the QB will either decide he is too well-covered or will try to throw the ball to a place that the CB cannot get to and the WR has the greatest chance to catch it. When the ball is thrown, the CB makes a decision whether he will attempt to knock the ball down, go for the INT, or realize he can't get there in time and try to make the tackle. If he chooses to try to make an INT, he is less likely to knock the ball down, and if he is unsuccessful at getting the ball in this case, the WR may have a better shot at making the catch. The punish receiver/courage attributes also come into play with the WR catchability.

A more experienced CB will be less likely to try to make an INT if it is an extremely close call than one who is less experienced, but also a less experienced CB will be more likely to let the WR catch the ball than try to make a play on it. It's complicated, I know ... and hard to really explain ... but that's kind of a basic overview of how it works.


Are we talking about position experience? Or does years experience or games played have some hidden formula or factor we can't see? Also I might mention that experience at the QB position should've played in heavily for me if years or games played is a factor. The QB I was playing against was literally playing his 2nd regular season game ever, yet the guy was absolutely unstoppable.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
5/25/2016 12:55 pm
Experience is a composite of the position experience + the player's experience with the play he is running + the player's experience with the play the other team is running.

Re: Finally some game engine updates! Passing game has been revisited

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
5/25/2016 7:29 pm
New update for the next games, specifically what I'm looking for here is more sacks from the DL and less from the secondary while the QB is scrambling, and better scramble logic by the QB. I also tweaked up the QB accuracy a bit.