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Main - Beta Chat

Re: Beta update release

By setherick
3/12/2018 2:16 pm
jdavidbakr wrote:
Pushing a beta update today to turn down INTs and turn up completions. Also including some more play-by-play feedback if a pass is incomplete because it was poorly thrown as opposed to just a bad catch attempt.


The trade off for better M2M coverage should compensate for fewer INTs. Short passing has just been weird though.

Re: Beta update release

By setherick
3/13/2018 6:56 am
Short passing game still can't complete 50%: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/box/7786

But Ray's all pass long every down still scoring 50 a game: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/box/7773

I'm close to my limit here. Every thing that makes the game awful to play is still there and really getting worse.

1) Play Overuse - Designed to help prevent the overuse of certain blitz 2 plays that would just destroy leagues. All it does is encourage teams to blitz 2 more often and only provides a benefit to teams that have superior athletes. Result: Makes the game less competitive to new owners.

2) Passing Updates - Designed to get the ball out faster, allow for better QB reads, and a better distribution of passes. All it does is encourage teams to throw the ball long more often because the QB will complete enough of them that go for 50+ yards that it won't matter if he completes 50% or throws 4 INTs, or the QB will dump the ball off to the RB.

I'm stoked to play in veteran leagues that abuse the **** out of 1 and 2 above. Stoked. I mean I don't even need to game plan anymore.

---

Here's some examples of our high school QBs masquerading as All Pros.

WR completely beats his man, QB has all day to throw, no reason why my 100 everything QB puts this BEHIND the WR: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/7786#1406240

TE has his man beat, but the QB throws it into double coverage: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/7786#1406274

What was this pass? Hewitt was in the slot and wide open. QB again had an hour to make a decision and throws the ball this badly? https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/7786#1406282

Both WRs are one-on-one on the outside, but the QB throws it into triple coverage: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/7786#1406295

Solid pocket and a wide open WR turn every 100 ACC QB into Ryan Leaf: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/7786#1406299

I stopped watching because QB play on short and intermediate routes is so bad. It's almost like the changes to decision making completely broke ball placement and timing. (Although short passing is pretty awful in standard leagues too: https://usflwfl.myfootballnow.com/box/1166. Was Arm the illogical attribute that determined whether a ball would be intercepted? I think I remember that from another thread.)
Last edited at 3/13/2018 7:18 am

Re: Beta update release

By setherick
3/13/2018 7:33 am
jdavidbakr wrote:
Here's some stat digging for you ... this is not either of the live beta leagues, but is the all-AI league running about a half of a season. There are two images in this zip file, one is completion percentage and the other is interception percentage. The first column is the QB's accuracy attribute, the second column is the pass distance (the distance the ball actually traveled, not the downfield distance, so a 5-yard out pattern might travel 10 or 15 actual yards), and the a chart of the completion or interception percentage. The color of each bar is darker with more attempts.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.myfootballnow.com/misc/Completion+Percentage+-+Interception+Percentage.zip


Went back and took another look at this illustration, and it confirmed something that I suspected for a long time. If you want to run a short passing game and not throw interceptions, your best bet is to get a QB of between 80-90 ACC. They have the lowest interception rates for that distance, and they have equal completion rates as QBs with 90-100 ACC. I'm not sure what these charts were supposed to show, but they show a huge hole right now in QB generation.

Re: Beta update release

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
3/13/2018 8:26 am
Here's a full season of completion percentage and interception percentage by pass distance. I feel like the breakdown by accuracy rating resulted in too small of a sample set. BTW, I think the throw-aways were being included in the 0-5 distance range, so I removed them from the chart.





FWIW, I'm not trying to prove or disprove anything with these charts, just putting them up hoping for objective feedback in combination with your own anecdotal experience as to what might be working and why what is not working might not be working.
Last edited at 3/13/2018 8:41 am

Re: Beta update release

By raymattison21
3/13/2018 8:53 am
jdavidbakr wrote:
Here's a full season of completion percentage and interception percentage by pass distance. I feel like the breakdown by accuracy rating resulted in too small of a sample set. BTW, I think the throw-aways were being included in the 0-5 distance range, so I removed them from the chart.





FWIW, I'm not trying to prove or disprove anything with these charts, just putting them up hoping for objective feedback in combination with your own anecdotal experience as to what might be working and why what is not working might not be working.


Trying to find some nfl data to back it up , but anything over twenty yards down feild is a deep pass. Groupings 20 and 25 yards are too high in completion % and too low for interception %. Quicker reads and throws only resulted in 2 passes over 35 yards all season long ? That interception % for 30 yard passes it too low as well.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/pass-atlas-a-map-of-where-nfl-quarterbacks-throw-the-ball/

This is a good one .....Completion % severely drop after 20-25 yards.

These numbers should drive all passes to be attempted under or around 10 yards to make up around 70 percent of all passes. Your chart has that number including up to 25 yard passes. Because it too easy to pass at those ranges...why pass short
Last edited at 3/13/2018 9:14 am

Re: Beta update release

By Beercloud
3/13/2018 10:02 am
Is this is still yds the ball travels or yds from line of scrimmage?

Re: Beta update release

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
3/13/2018 11:15 am
Beercloud wrote:
Is this is still yds the ball travels or yds from line of scrimmage?


It's all still yards the ball travels, not yards from line of scrimmage.

Re: Beta update release

By setherick
3/15/2018 3:59 am
I quit.

Enjoy digging through the film on the 17(!) interceptions from this game. All from wobbly passes from our apparently tiny hands QBs: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/log/7796

The game plan matrix and rules engine is also hopelessly broken. I set my game plan up to call my base defensive plays with my LBs in M2M, Zone, or Zone In most of the game, and I called just as many blitzes as ever. Seriously, on Med and Long downs my team should have been set up to call a blitz 10% of the time. I called a blitz the first three plays, including a blitz out of the normal defensive backfield against the 113 on a third and long. You know when the game plan is supposed to default to Nickle and I DO NOT HAVE A RULE that says call the normal defensive backfield against the 113 on third and long. BUT I DO HAVE ONE THAT SAYS CALL A ZONE!

I don't have the time or energy anymore. I'm just going to ignore beta for a few weeks...
Last edited at 3/15/2018 4:19 am

Re: Beta update release

By JCSwishMan33
3/15/2018 4:37 am
A couple observations... I'll add as I find them, and paste example plays once I'm on a computer:

- Kicking / punting completely clanked... Distances went impossibly down, like the ball's made out of depleted uranium now. Also, punters seem to be holding the ball for much (relatively speaking) longer before getting a punt off. *** Almost feels like punters are trying to pooch / onside on each punt ***

- Runners being "stood up" on the initial hit much more... Not sure if that one was intentional, but I don't think runners should go stock stiff on a hit without going right down. A pretty telling one right here: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/7801#1409862
*** Relatedly, fumbles seem to be excessive ***

- Passing Release seems to have gone by the wayside. Example, my starting QB Brandon Hale has an 87 Pass Release, but felt like 90% of the plays the new PBP had him releasing the ball like he was my 4-year old, even in a clean pocket. Detroit's QB John Moore's Pass Release is 92, and his PBP looked similarly bad.

- (UI) I had a field goal attempt go off with absolutely no PBP text... Just time and field position. I counted at least 7 in the log, but I recall there were some FG attempts that gave proper PBP when watching live. Example: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/7801#1409667
Last edited at 3/15/2018 5:04 am

Re: Beta update release

By raymattison21
3/15/2018 6:32 am
Kicking was broke . It seems those plays were hit with severe abuse penalty . As if the players had no ratings at all .