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Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By TheAdmiral
9/26/2020 7:02 am
Conditioning?, b'n'r?, intelligence?, discipline?

roll of the dice? best doesn't always win?

Play familiarity?

There could be dozens of reasons on every play - could be your guys just having a bad day or a bad play

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By raymattison21
9/26/2020 8:45 am
TheAdmiral wrote:
Conditioning?, b'n'r?, intelligence?, discipline?

roll of the dice? best doesn't always win?

Play familiarity?

There could be dozens of reasons on every play - could be your guys just having a bad day or a bad play



Which play were you referring to ? This was only the first quarter. So we can rule out play overuse but that about it. The factors you speak of a minor and should be seen when ratings are close. Discipline is only used for penalties . To be real this is a gentle analysis .....and bump and run is way over powered and was accounted for here

Your supposed deep pass 35+ Air yards was to a dump off? Really? Why was he able to get behind the safeties on the first place when the faster WRs had a 5-7 yard head start. It’s what messing with reads. The outside wrs can’t get open quick enough making the third options and dump off the primaries....or auto reads on almost every play.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By raymattison21
9/26/2020 11:02 am
raymattison21 wrote:
TheAdmiral wrote:
Conditioning?, b'n'r?, intelligence?, discipline?

roll of the dice? best doesn't always win?

Play familiarity?

There could be dozens of reasons on every play - could be your guys just having a bad day or a bad play



Which play were you referring to ? This was only the first quarter. So we can rule out play overuse but that about it. The factors you speak of a minor and should be seen when ratings are close. Discipline is only used for penalties . To be real this is a gentle analysis .....and bump and run is way over powered and was accounted for here

Your supposed deep pass 35+ Air yards was to a dump off? Really? Why was he able to get behind the safeties on the first place when the faster WRs had a 5-7 yard head start. It’s what messing with reads. The outside wrs can’t get open quick enough making the third options and dump off the primaries....or auto reads on almost every play.


https://victory.myfootballnow.com/watch/319#56092

It was a 20 + air yards pass. Being zone a 3 deep with the cb1 dropping into the flats makes the easy read being the wr1 streaking past the shallow zone and the QB sneaking that pass in near the sidelines deep but before the safety rotating over to pick up that deep third.

For one the qb should have rolled into the zone rotation and like I said lobbed it right over the cb1s head but before the safety. The wr1 has better route than cb1 and the safeties. Keegan has all the skills to make that throw deeper throw.... well accuracy is key and he is a bit weak there for our code.

But both WRs stutter slowing there long routes considerably and it looks as none of the DBs bite. The safeties wander back and forth barely getting to desired spots in a timely manner but they did have lower zone abilities. So....

The FB , the target , stutters as well the LBer with less zone bites and the qb dumps it in there. Good or bad IRL that FB should be open when the LBers are too deep and the pass comes underneath. Rarely would it happen like this. My bets is this is a way to exploit the code some.

Focusing on particular parts of the code as to why the pass went the way it did and not the obvious choice probably takes into account alot of factors like you said but.....

When The WRs stutters is most likely what’s slowing them down too much. Forcing all these dump offs in to an early read.

Or is it bump? I don’t think so cause it’s zone.

I have heard man slows WRs down through out out there route....is that active in our code?

Tack on the “sack clock” and things get messy on this long pass but the stutters are messing with timing /reads.

Have guys get through that stutter quicker. My bets are the DBs even when they lose the coverage roll won’t be so far off interms of recovery. Like that punter covering the qb ....it looked good the guy got beat but not for large yards after the catch.

I had coverage indicators , in the play by play verbage, for a wr playing dB vs a talented wr that said it was bad coverage but he knocked it down anyway. That not bad coverage? Well unless the athletic abilities helped him recover in time but still he didn’t bite bad.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By Smirt211
9/26/2020 11:36 am
Oh, lord.

You just have to tinker and figure out what plays is the QB more apt to run on. I appreciate that you have the technical wiring down amazingly but ...paralysis by analysis.

If I tried to figure out how every chess moved on a certain play....how and why my head would explode.


Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By TheAdmiral
9/26/2020 12:14 pm
raymattison21 wrote:
TheAdmiral wrote:
Conditioning?, b'n'r?, intelligence?, discipline?

roll of the dice? best doesn't always win?

Play familiarity?

There could be dozens of reasons on every play - could be your guys just having a bad day or a bad play



Which play were you referring to ? This was only the first quarter. So we can rule out play overuse but that about it. The factors you speak of a minor and should be seen when ratings are close. Discipline is only used for penalties . To be real this is a gentle analysis .....and bump and run is way over powered and was accounted for here

Your supposed deep pass 35+ Air yards was to a dump off? Really? Why was he able to get behind the safeties on the first place when the faster WRs had a 5-7 yard head start. It’s what messing with reads. The outside wrs can’t get open quick enough making the third options and dump off the primaries....or auto reads on almost every play.



I thought it was an interesting play, the only pass in the game that went 20+ through the air.

The play was Strong I normal PA All Go
D were playing Zone with Linebackers shallow and secondary deep

Breaking it down, they dropped into 2 deep safeties. The FB ran a stop go up the middle the LB had low accel so after stopping him, he burned past him with a mismatch in accel. The TE drew the one Safety leaving the FB free until the other Safety got across to run him down, by which time the MLB had got back to make the tackle (according to play description - I thought the Safety got there first but thats a moot point).

You could argue that the FB is not the primary target or that the QB drew the Safety wide by focusing on the (primary receiver) wideout and then dropped a ball into the wide open FB. The Primary target isn't always going to be the best option, especially on a misdirection play.

I think I might use pre-season to have a look at more plays where the ball is thrown deep.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By raymattison21
9/26/2020 12:54 pm
TheAdmiral wrote:
raymattison21 wrote:
TheAdmiral wrote:
Conditioning?, b'n'r?, intelligence?, discipline?

roll of the dice? best doesn't always win?

Play familiarity?

There could be dozens of reasons on every play - could be your guys just having a bad day or a bad play



Which play were you referring to ? This was only the first quarter. So we can rule out play overuse but that about it. The factors you speak of a minor and should be seen when ratings are close. Discipline is only used for penalties . To be real this is a gentle analysis .....and bump and run is way over powered and was accounted for here

Your supposed deep pass 35+ Air yards was to a dump off? Really? Why was he able to get behind the safeties on the first place when the faster WRs had a 5-7 yard head start. It’s what messing with reads. The outside wrs can’t get open quick enough making the third options and dump off the primaries....or auto reads on almost every play.



I thought it was an interesting play, the only pass in the game that went 20+ through the air.

The play was Strong I normal PA All Go
D were playing Zone with Linebackers shallow and secondary deep

Breaking it down, they dropped into 2 deep safeties. The FB ran a stop go up the middle the LB had low accel so after stopping him, he burned past him with a mismatch in accel. The TE drew the one Safety leaving the FB free until the other Safety got across to run him down, by which time the MLB had got back to make the tackle (according to play description - I thought the Safety got there first but thats a moot point).

You could argue that the FB is not the primary target or that the QB drew the Safety wide by focusing on the (primary receiver) wideout and then dropped a ball into the wide open FB. The Primary target isn't always going to be the best option, especially on a misdirection play.

I think I might use pre-season to have a look at more plays where the ball is thrown dee p.


At the 7:04 mark on the clock only the CB1 and CB 2 are covering correctly. Everyone else is bunched together.

It worked out similar to your description but a lot of needless time and energy was wasted by the DBs. The problem here isn’t the skill per say it’s the actual assignment within the code and how it visually reacts.

my gripes are within that stutter. a wasted move by the receiver and it hurts the timing of dump off cause the wrs can’t reach the end of thier routes quick enough....making it a dump off play the majority of the time
Last edited at 9/26/2020 2:43 pm

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By raymattison21
9/26/2020 12:56 pm
Smirt211 wrote:
Oh, lord.

You just have to tinker and figure out what plays is the QB more apt to run on. I appreciate that you have the technical wiring down amazingly but ...paralysis by analysis.

If I tried to figure out how every chess moved on a certain play....how and why my head would explode.




I was going to try as well . By using a lot of blockers and not recievers. Especially the dump off option. Combined with a fast QB ...maybe a dumb one with receivers who can’t get open. Or just that rollout play.
Last edited at 9/26/2020 12:56 pm

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By Smirt211
9/26/2020 1:04 pm
Yeah, I'd start with that. I'd think the PA Roll-out play would be deadly now with the proper QB.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By TheAdmiral
9/26/2020 5:37 pm
Smirt211 wrote:
Yeah, I'd start with that. I'd think the PA Roll-out play would be deadly now with the proper QB.



Boom/Bust I'd guess and more Bust than boom.

Although play action could be a viable option in this code.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By raymattison21
9/26/2020 5:52 pm
A couple of the guys I checked were facing a man under defensive scheme when they took off . That s a good thing but it didn’t seem to have any other real correlation . Slow QBs fast QBs all ran . Blitzes, 4 man fronts, and 3 man fronts all had runs against them . I wonder how much of line play has to do with it.

Our game had a bunch of sacks and drops....less knockdowns but plenty of qb scramble opportunities. They just didn’t take off.
Last edited at 9/26/2020 5:53 pm