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Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By TheAdmiral
9/28/2020 5:16 am
356 sacks in 32 pre-season games to date
248 hurries

392 knockdowns
264 drops

Early indications suggesting completion % is low. I look into this in more detail later.

BUT...it's pre-season so lots of players rolling in and out of the game, teams trying new plays.


potential tweaks. increase chance of completion (slightly) on ***** that travel 20+ through the air, increase moderately ***** travelling 10-19 in the air. keep passes of less than 10 yards approx. the same.

Rushing yards look about right (at first glance) I'll look deeper later so blocking is probably about right - despite all the sacks. Suggesting the QB needs to throw the ball away more often, which in turn should lead to an upturn in Interceptions only 52 in 32 games (with lots of backups getting playing time).

I'm not sure if volatility is involved in anything but potential ratings, but combined with intelligence, discipline, scrambing and avoid fumble could impact whether the QB tucks and runs, throws the ball away, tries to force a pass or takes the sack

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By TheAdmiral
9/28/2020 6:22 pm
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RJbzUKG7E_4E4lh4yThgEXsIdLPX0Guty3yhRJRVBco/edit?usp=sharing

Up to date stats on week week 2 of pre-season

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By Infinity on Trial
9/28/2020 7:49 pm
I'll be the first to say it: There are too many sacks now.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By TheAdmiral
9/29/2020 5:01 am
You weren't the first ;0)

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By raymattison21
9/29/2020 6:14 am
TheAdmiral wrote:




I'm not sure if volatility is involved in anything but potential ratings, but combined with intelligence, discipline, scrambing and avoid fumble could impact whether the QB tucks and runs, throws the ball away, tries to force a pass or takes the sack


The way I see it is there is an area around the QB that is his ability to feel pressure. I think it’s the same size for everyone. Well maybe younger guys are smaller.

Then scrambling is used to determine how often he will set his feet. The higher the scramble the more likely he will move and then again be able to feel where the pressure is coming.

Some where in there he decides whether to take off and run....possibly after his reads and maybe Intelligence/ experience driven.

Again most likely Intelligence driven he will throw it away. 4.3 codes had real nice development of this aspect of football. Pressure would come guys would roll towards the line and either throw it away before the sack. Or Sometimes they would find an open guy at the last second or just take a 1 or 2 yard sack. Good potential is there in my mind but this was the old QBs logic. So....

Forcing a pass probably is a multitude of things but at one time ....the way pressure changes the effectiveness of QBs throws was tweaked. Making it easier to stand strong and deliver a good throw. That helped vs the tighter coverage ....I am seeing guys do this now but is it the best choice to throw to in the first place?

Still too many double and triple coverage that’s thrown into. Two factors related to coverage make it look bad. One the off ball defenders in man (watch the CB1) will peel off his coverage assignment when the ball is thrown to make big plays in the flats.

The other is all you need is speed acceleration and punish to make DBs play like superstars. Really just have them in the right spot at the pre designated time the QBs throws (sackclock) vs the “right defensive call” .

Decent man and bump slows the WRs so much longer passes to the outside just don’t work. We got tons of wide open drags being ignored completely every pass. As we are only calling plays with no backs (or dump offs) and real spread sets.

We get some passes off in shorter scenarios but it’s almost always to the third and fourth options. Maybe they are the primary’s in those plays but the qb will never force it to the outside wrs....even when they are dragging in.

Long passes we threw 12 so far.... 6 were sacks two were completed to slot receivers (one vs a heavy blitz) for 50 yards total....to bad we lost 40 yards on sacks. This part of the game has been missing since 4.3 and needs to be back.

And I get that QBs are running but not ours ....why?
Last edited at 9/29/2020 6:19 am

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By Smirt211
9/29/2020 6:45 am
To get your QB to scramble I'd think it would work in the following way:

1) Obtain a QB whom will give you a competitive advantage in your pursuit of it. (SCRAMBLE - I forgot this/Acceleration/Speed/Ball Carry/Avoid Fumble/Intelligence in that order)

2) Keep a keen eye on what play(s) oft lead to the QB taking off. A lot of this can be construed when you play a plugged in opposing GM such as Admiral would be in this case. What did he get me with? Aha, ok, I need to splash that ingredient in. I wrote down a few play ideas and one would think the PA Roll-out is the prime play since it rolls the QB way out, creating chaotic movement.

3) Pushing the potential scramble plays hard - mashing 'em to learn it + scouting your opponent rigorously. Selecting the right defensive plays to try and win your strategy over.

4) Have your opponent deep into pass key usage. You'd think that this coupled with intense play knowledge would lead your QB to adapt and possibly run off of deeply covered passing routes.

Edit: I see Admiral got off a 15 yard run with a 10 speed, 69 acceleration QB but the thought process is if you're going all-in with the strategy you want to overwhelm with it.



Last edited at 9/29/2020 6:53 am

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By Smirt211
9/29/2020 7:05 am
Ok, I see what's going on. It's definite risk/reward and pushed off to the long passes. 1 game alone I saw the same pass get a 14 yard run and a 6-yard sack loss.

Basically, if you're shooting for this you better have the proper QB and be dedicated to it....to minimize the sacks, maximize the rushing ability.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By raymattison21
9/29/2020 7:56 am
Smirt211 wrote:
To get your QB to scramble I'd think it would work in the following way:

1) Obtain a QB whom will give you a competitive advantage in your pursuit of it. (SCRAMBLE - I forgot this/Acceleration/Speed/Ball Carry/Avoid Fumble/Intelligence in that order)

2) Keep a keen eye on what play(s) oft lead to the QB taking off. A lot of this can be construed when you play a plugged in opposing GM such as Admiral would be in this case. What did he get me with? Aha, ok, I need to splash that ingredient in. I wrote down a few play ideas and one would think the PA Roll-out is the prime play since it rolls the QB way out, creating chaotic movement.

3) Pushing the potential scramble plays hard - mashing 'em to learn it + scouting your opponent rigorously. Selecting the right defensive plays to try and win your strategy over.

4) Have your opponent deep into pass key usage. You'd think that this coupled with intense play knowledge would lead your QB to adapt and possibly run off of deeply covered passing routes.

Edit: I see Admiral got off a 15 yard run with a 10 speed, 69 acceleration QB but the thought process is if you're going all-in with the strategy you want to overwhelm with it.





Sure but why do nfl QBs scramble and if you include scramble sacks take off 10-15% of the time? Not 2 % like here.

It’s supposed to be the scrambling skill here but once again skills don’t matter ......it’s some concoction of sensitive factors that make the game viewer look strange.

Like I said the reason we don’t do it more here is cause the defense is clueless as what the nfl like responsibility has them do. Yet alone the fact the assignments just are not there within the plays

Using spread sets should not result in zero qb scrambles while using bigger sets results in more? But that’s how it is

On the defensive end playing man should expose you to big scrambling. And without a spy, one who’s more athletic than the QBs, should those scrambles end up as big gains.

I don’t think a spy does anything here that’s nfl like. He could turn the frequency up but it would be an exploit.

I don’t have the pa roll out but waggle hasn’t worked either. For me it better for the game to work right than spend time ....half a season upping familiarity just to scramble. I want some one to come in and the game work like football. Not have them spend time making it work kinda like football.

Admiral stats say it all. Too many sacks not enough hurries. QBs are taking sacks when they should not be. Pressure is still low compared to the nfl. QBs just don’t know what to do when facing it. A trend with each code release. Except that small window somewhere in the 4.3 code.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By Infinity on Trial
9/29/2020 8:55 am
TheAdmiral wrote:
You weren't the first ;0)


I see "despite the sacks" and "bunch of sacks," but nobody pointing out that this should be fixed.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 0d5f5ac

By Infinity on Trial
9/29/2020 8:59 am
raymattison21 wrote:
QBs are taking sacks when they should not be. Pressure is still low compared to the nfl. QBs just don’t know what to do when facing it. A trend with each code release.


This.

Serious question, though: A comprehensive fix will take longer than any of us wants, so what's the path to getting this released soon? Hope for some middle-ground tweak where there is a reasonable amount of sacks but pressure is still broken?