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Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By setherick
9/20/2020 8:26 am
Smirt211 wrote:
4-3 Double LB blitz

We have to hit the way back machine to post mortem v4.2.

Those whom weren't here wouldn't know the game. Those whom have been know the deal.

You displayed the technical wiring behind why it doesn't work or the twin CB #3/LB Bitzes (you know which ones). Non-technical. An end was put to them and one's ability to sit in run key while pass blitzing to cover and scorch earth every single offensive play with its streaming.

Still today it still holds to where they are not usable through over-used penalties (you get zapped on them) or ineffectiveness to promote users not using them.

Is that pretty much the case?




There are intermediate steps missing here.

0.4.2-0.4.3 was the real "overuse got me" period of the game. During that period, the QB clock hadn't been adjusted up, and blitzes still worked, so overuse suddenly got real.

You could run the Double LB blitz all game strategy that dominated the < 4.2 days, and you'd win the first quarter. Then you'd lose 70-0 for the rest of the game as the QB threw long hot read TD after long hot read TD because of blitz recognition.

That was dialed down in 4.4-4.5 at the same time that the QB clock was adjusted up to allow for more dump offs against the blitz.

There was a period of time in 4.5 beta where the QB clock wasn't so sensitive, QBs scanned the field, and hit open receivers. This was right around the time that I wrote the Passing Levels, Spacing, Zones post in the general forum -- which ended up being of no use when 4.5 was actually released.
Last edited at 9/20/2020 8:29 am

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By Smirt211
9/20/2020 8:59 am
That was an excellent post. I remember it.

I believe some of it still carried through to today. At the time I weaved a little of it into what I do. I was adhering to it already but was also mindful to what pass plays I should avoid moving forward. I still watch for that. Crowded/overlapping routes...

Best example of what works today and is an embodiment of that post would be the 2-1-2 Medium Passes (there's 2 of them) with the TE involved. WRs spaced out, RB out of the back field and the TE going up and in to the middle of the field.

Last edited at 9/20/2020 8:59 am

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By Infinity on Trial
9/20/2020 10:17 am
It does beg the question: Why are there any overuse penalties on defense when blitzes don't work anyway?

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By setherick
9/20/2020 10:25 am
Infinity on Trial wrote:
It does beg the question: Why are there any overuse penalties on defense when blitzes don't work anyway?


It's because it's two different versions of the code counteracting one another. Blitzes USED to work. QBs USED to scan the field and throw the right distance.

If the QBs held the ball twice as long on medium downs, OR WRs got off the line appropriately fast (seriously the 10 and 20 yard splits are insanely slow on Medium and Long routes), OR if WRs didn't drop every long ball, the passing game would be different.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By Infinity on Trial
9/20/2020 3:20 pm
raymattison21 wrote:
Do you mean this season 2036?


No. I mean 4.5 is the code you asked for, and you should own it.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By raymattison21
9/20/2020 3:44 pm
Infinity on Trial wrote:
raymattison21 wrote:
Do you mean this season 2036?


No. I mean 4.5 is the code you asked for, and you should own it.



It’s will make no difference either way. Move on

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By raymattison21
9/20/2020 3:49 pm
setherick wrote:
This is wrong. There are very few plays that produce any pressure from the LB position, and most of those are producing pressure with overrides.

Like the GL Attack. The only way the LB gets pressure is when you swap in your 95 SP DB, and then the position becomes a menace. Same thing with the Dime MLB SS blitz.

Your classic blitzes like the 4-3 Double LB blitz don't provide any pressure from the LB spot because:

1) The blitzes are too slow
2) The blitzes are not "hidden" (There is only one roll to determine if the QB is going to see the blitz, which he wins all the time)
3) The QB is getting rid of the ball as soon as the LB hits the LOS

The sensitivity of the clock doesn't just affect pressure for what it's worth. It's also the real reason why there are not more downfield throws (which receivers are only going to drop anyway). The QB doesn't hold the ball long enough for these routes to develop.

Also, I would hope JDB has stats for all of this. I collect data for game planning purposes. I'm not developing the code.


None blitz plays still will have horrible reads. Yes the blitz ones will be better

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By Infinity on Trial
9/20/2020 4:08 pm
Perhaps you're right. But I can't help but wonder, why does 4.6 not address the biggest problem with 4.5: poor passing.

I rejoined this league when I saw JDB comment that he planned to release this code at the end of the regular season. It was immediately obvious to me that passing, somehow, had gotten worse! You took care of punt blocks and nerfed the 46, but somehow made it harder to complete a pass. Again.

Given the depleted ranks of GMs, general frustration, and delay since the last overhaul, I still think it would be a good idea to release 4.6. It is nice to see the boost in the running game. But it should come with the caveat that issues with the passing game are still in development and a commitment to release another upgrade sooner this time.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By Infinity on Trial
9/21/2020 7:58 am
Championship game features 35/68 passing with six INTs for 471 yards (6.9 per attempt). The yardage includes an early 49-yarder and a late 76-yarder. Two sacks — one against a long pass, and one from a three-man rush.

Re: [0.4.6] Version 09d60821

By Infinity on Trial
9/21/2020 8:00 am
Here's the start of a six-plays stretch that includes four interceptions: https://mfn1.myfootballnow.com/watch/11988#2234810